This week, we try to understand Stephen Miran’s world view and what it could mean for currencies and the global economic order. Host Stephanie Flanders is joined by Shawn Donnan, senior writer for economics with Bloomberg, and Mark Sobel, the US chairman of the Official Monetary and Financial Institutions Forum.

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Instead of the “Trump bump” we were talking about at the beginning of the year, a combination of mass terminations across the federal government (many of which may be illegal), sweeping tariffs and a whole lot of uncertainty could be leading to a Trump slump. Or is it, as Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent reassured us this week, just a period of transition?

That’s the question we tackle on this episode of Trumponomics. Host Stephanie Flanders speaks with Evercore ISI’s Kathryn Holston, who served as a White House senior economist last year and before that in the office of the chief economist of the World Bank, and Anna Wong, chief US economist for Bloomberg Economics.

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Host Stephanie Flanders speaks with Joshua Green, national correspondent at Bloomberg Businessweek, and editor Laura Davison about the likelihood of a shutdown, its consequences for the government and for Americans—and whether anything can stop Musk’s efforts to shrink the government.

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