In this episode, Marc and Emily explore their very different relationships with goal setting. What starts as a reflection on abandoned international travel dreams quickly turns into a candid conversation about how goals can serve—or burden—us.

Marc shares his long history of goal-setting (and the ways it still trips him up), including his yearly list of 100 “magnet goals” and the mental gymnastics involved in sticking to goals like “visit one brewery a month.” Emily reflects on how her earliest experience with goal setting was punitive and tied to shame—shaping a lifelong tension with traditional goal frameworks.

They talk about neurodivergence, executive function, the false sense of completion that sometimes comes just from planning a goal, and the difference between forward-focused and backward-looking intentions. Along the way, they share practical reframes and offer each other new language for celebrating progress.

If you’ve ever struggled with how to make goal setting feel more human—or you’ve wondered whether there’s another way to approach productivity—this episode offers a thoughtful, honest, and often funny look at the topic.

Key Takeaways

• Not everyone has the same relationship with goals—some find them motivating, others experience them as shame-triggering.
• “Magnet Goals” can be a creative, idea-based alternative to rigid planning.
• Sharing goals publicly can create a false sense of completion.
• Neurodivergent brains often use emotional weight to create momentum, which can be both helpful and exhausting.
• Setting goals in retrospect (looking at what you did rather than what you planned) may be a more useful approach for some.

Quote Highlights

“I’m still figuring out how to set goals without shame being part of the process.” – Marc
“Maybe I’ll just do goal setting backwards—looking for the goals I didn’t know I set.” – Emily
“Goal setting feels like a dialect to you. For me, it still feels like a foreign language.” – Emily
“There’s a kind of figuring it out that feels like play—and a kind that feels like punishment.” – Emily
“I’ve been goal-setting since I was 14. And I’m still surprised how much pressure I put on myself.” – Marc

Resources & Mentions

• Magnet Goals Framework
• Enneagram Type 7 (referenced in Marc’s reflections on anticipation and follow-through)
• Zoho Campaigns & SpeakerFlow (tools Marc mentions wrangling)
• Shad Helmstetter, Zig Ziglar, Brian Tracy (classic goal-setting cassette tape influences)