Episode 10 in the serial series ‘Farewell Evangelicalism’, designed to name malformed pillars that shape evangelical/conservative Christian thought and beliefs. The hope is to catalyze pathways for folks to leave this faith tradition that does more harm than good. In this episode, we discuss trans identity and liberation. Sexuality and gender constructs are a significant pillars in evangelical identity. Anything that goes against the white cis-gendered, straight able-bodied male gaze is to a threat.

Why should this conversation matter if you’re not trans? Because you’re a curious human who wants to understand what a wide liberation ethic looks like. In this moment, 2025, trans folks are the primary target of conservative politicians and religious leaders, who better to learn from on what liberation looks like than the very folks furthest from the center? So through the example of Jesus where the last shall be first, this episode features two trans voices speaking to trans identity, but also showing us all what liberation looks like, a picture most of us wouldn’t come up with on our own unless we sat at the feet of trans teachers.

Episode 10 Show Notes

(00:00) Introduction with Rohadi (05:34) Celeste Irwin and her story. (12:00) Finding liberation escaping religious community. (16:00) Finding her whole self. (18:40) Naming malformed policies in conservative ideology/Christian right. (34:24) Pivot to Dr. Roberto (35:12) Intro Dr. Roberto Espinoza and his story. (39:20) Finding home on the land. (42:00) Finding healing in the body. (47:20) A trans take on the resurrection and signals for future hope. (57:25) The threat to our democracy and the power of stories. (1:01:00) Where is the light?

Featuring your host: Rohadi Nagassar (he/him)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Celeste Irwin (she/her) – Trans Activist and Writer

Celeste is a transgender, lesbian woman. She is a writer and advocate for transgender rights and inclusion in Christian spaces. Having survived an abusive church, she also writes about spiritual abuse. Visit her website/Substack and find her on BlueSky.

Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza (he/him) – Public Theologian and Author

Dr. Roberto Che Espinoza is a Transgender & Latinx public scholar, using imaginative narrative to steward more ethical futures. Find more about his resources and exoertise on his website: https://robertoche.com/. Find his Substack and Instagram.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat; Intro by Jesse Peters

Episode 9 in the serial season called ‘Farewell Evangelicalism’ is now live!

In this episode, we discuss the embodied work necessary after losing core elements in our life like faith. We name pathways to help process leaving church, including the loss of community, and the mountain of grief that follows.

Episode 9 Show Notes

(00:00) Introduction with Rohadi on grief and loss. (04:24) Grief Coach – Mandy Capehart (32:00) Intro Meghan Crozier (46:00) Losing community after leaving church community. (56:20) Components that help grieve. (59:00) Cautions for folks entering the deconstruction space.

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Mandy Capehart – Grief Coach and Podcaster Mandy Capehart (she/her/hers) is the founder of the Restorative Grief model. Find more about Mandy and her coaching program at https://www.mandycapehart.com/. Find her latest podcast episodes and her publication on grief.

Meghan Crozier – Community Catalyst and Podcaster Visit Meghan over at The Pursuing Life! Meghan lives in the Pacific Northwest. Meghan curates space to help folks wrestle with questions on deconstruction and what spiritual growth looks like. She writes about topics like faith deconstruction, spirituality, equity, justice, race, mental health, and religion. She also explore the same themes and topics on the Thereafter Podcast with co-host, Cortland Coffey.

Bumper music by Daniel Wheat; Intro by Jesse Peters Find Dr. Hillary McBride’s Holy Hurt podcast. Data on homicides and evangelicalism here.

Featuring: Rohadi Nagassar, Janice Lagata, LetGregLive, Kristian A. Smith

The term: Deconstruction defined in Rohadi’s book, When We Belong, is: the work to reclaim what gives life; discard what does not; and create beautiful stories. Welcome to Episode 8 where we venture through the land of religious deconstruction, only this time through the Black and brown church experiences.

In this episode we hear from Janice Lagata who shares her story about the eventual implosion of Hillsong New York. Followed by Greg, who provides some insight on the work of deconstruction and decolonization out of a Black church experience. Lastly, Kristian A Smith and Rohadi talk about what faith can look like beyond the gaze of white hegemony. All this and more in Episode 8.

Episode 8 Show Notes

(00:00-04:00) Introduction with Rohadi (04:24) Janice Lagata (09:00) Broaching the Death of Hillsong New York (26:00) Interrogating the deconstruction space on socials. (29:40) Intro to Greg (31:00) Greg intro (34:00) Black Deconstruction (39:20) Christian supremacy (44:00) Intro Kristian A Smith (45:00) A different take on deconstruction. (53:20) The weird in Black and brown church traditions. (57:00) Reclamation project. Where to find life. (1:02:00) on decolonizing

Featuring your host, Rohadi (from Rohadi.com)

Rohadi’s books can be found here, including his latest publication, When We Belong. Reclaiming Christianity on the Margins. Visit his online church community: https://abeautifultable.ca/

Janice Lagata – Musician and Podcaster Find more from Janice on her website. Stream her latest album “Toxic Empathy” on Spotify or AppleMusic.

Greg – Muscian and Teacher Educator. Baritenor. Musical Theatre Enthusiast. Sinfonian. B.M.Ed, M.S., Ed.S.

Kristian A Smith – Pastor and Podcaster Find him on Instagram. Community Builder; Founder & Pastor @tfc.virtual; Host @holysmokesmovement; Curator of Greatest Commandment Theology. Find him over at kristianasmith.com

Bumper music by Janice Lagata; Intro by Jesse Peters