Originally recorded on 11-27-2024
In this episode, Matt and Alexis talk about the 1st President, George Washington, the "foundingest father," who was incredibly conscious that everything he did would set precedent for the young country he founded. Washington had as much ego, as much to prove, and as much interest in power as the 44 men who have followed him in office, but he balanced his unmatched service to his country with his desire to have a private life in a way that defines virtue in the highest office in the country.

Alexis Coe
Alexis Coe is an award-winning, New York Times bestselling presidential historian and senior fellow at New America, a bi-partisan think tank. Coe is the leading presidential biographer of her generation, known for her unique insights, engaging style, and ability to reach larger, more diverse audiences in different mediums.

Her books have achieved critical and commercial success. She is the author of, most recently, You Never Forget Your First: A Biography of George of Washington. Her next book, Young Jack: A Biography of John F. Kennedy, 1917-1957, will be published in 2025, and her first book, Alice+Freda Forever: A Murder in Memphis, debuted in 2014.

In 2024, Coe went on a 13-stop cross-country discussion tour for New America. Her project, "How Should a President Be," is in anticipation of America's 250th anniversary in 2026.

Coe frequently appears on CNN, MSNBC, CBS, History, PBS, and other networks. She was a consulting producer on, and featured in, Doris Kearns Goodwin's Washington series on the History Channel. She is a frequent guest on NPR and hosted the podcasts No Man's Land and Presidents Are People Too!

She has been featured in and written for most major publications, including the New Yorker, the New York Times, the Washington Post, and Best American Essays.

Coe has given keynote lectures and appeared on and moderated panels at Georgetown, the Library of Congress, West Point, the New York Historical Society, the National Constitution Center, the Lyndon B. Johnson Presidential Library, and many more.

She curated the ACLU'S 100 exhibitions. While in grad school, she was a project-based oral historian at the Brooklyn Historical Society. She went on to be a Research Curator in the Exhibitions Department at the New York Public Library in Bryant Park.

Coe serves on the 2024 Honorary Committee of the Library of Congress Lavine/Ken Burns Prize for Film and has long served on the board of advisors for the University of Georgia's History in the Headlines series. She is a member of Biographer's International.

She is based in New York.

00:00 Introduction to Country Over Self
00:33 Meet Alexis Coe: Presidential Historian
01:56 Discussing George Washington's Legacy
04:14 Washington's Relationship with Power
05:32 Washington's Early Life and Struggles
06:49 Washington's Rise to Prominence
11:55 Washington's Reluctance and Presidency
18:35 Washington's Second Term and Legacy
22:52 Washington's Decision to Retire
24:08 The Impact of Washington's Legacy
24:59 Modern Parallels: Biden's Presidency
27:20 Washington's Family and Political Advantage
31:42 Washington's Toughest Decisions
32:37 The Whiskey Rebellion: Washington's Misstep
36:35 Rapid Fire Questions: Presidential Reflections
41:30 Strengthening Democracy: Proposed Changes
43:24 Current Projects and Future Aspirations
45:30 Closing Remarks and Farewell

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Originally recorded on 10-24-24

In this episode, Matt and Sean talk about the 16th President, Abraham Lincoln, and the Emancipation Proclamation, one of the most defining moments in American history. Although arguably not so much Country Over Self in the moment, the Emancipation Proclamation was difficult both politically and with the general population, and it took the shrewdness and communication skills of Lincoln to bring it to life and change the course of the Civil War and the nation.

Sean Wilentz
Sean Wilentz studies U.S. political and social history. He received his Ph.D. in history from Yale University (1980) after earning bachelor’s degrees from Columbia University (1972) and Balliol College, Oxford University (1974). Chants Democratic (1984), which won several national prizes, including the Albert J. Beveridge Award of the American Historical Association, shows how the working class emerged in New York City and examines the changes in politics and political thought that came with it.

In The Kingdom of Matthias (1994), Professor Wilentz and coauthor Paul E. Johnson tell the story of a bizarre religious cult that sprang up in New York City in the 1830s, exploring in the process the darker corners of the 19th-century religious revival known as the Second Great Awakening. Professor Wilentz is also the coauthor and coeditor of The Key of Liberty (1993) and the editor of several other books, including The Rose and the Briar (2004, Greil Marcus coeditor), a collection of historical essays and artistic creations inspired by American ballads.

His The Rise of American Democracy: Jefferson to Lincoln (2005), was awarded the Bancroft Prize and was a finalist for the Pulitzer Prize. Subsequent books include The Age of Reagan: A History, 1974-2008, a reconsideration of U.S. politics since the Watergate affair; Bob Dylan in America, a consideration of Dylan's place in American cultural history; and The Politicians & The Egalitarians: The Hidden History of American Politics, a thematic collection of essays covering American political history from the Revolution through the 1960s.

His most recent study, No Property in Man: Slavery and Antislavery at the Nation’s Founding, based on his Nathan I. Huggins Lectures at Harvard, appeared in 2018 and was the recipient of the annual Thomas A. Cooley Book Prize for the best book on the Constitution, awarded by the Georgetown University Law Center. In 2020, the Library of America published the first of three projected volumes of his authoritative edition of the writings of the historian Richard Hofstadter.

Professor Wilentz has received numerous fellowships from, among other institutions, the John Simon Guggenheim Foundation, the American Council of Learned Societies, and the American Academy in Berlin. Formerly a contributing editor to The New Republic, and currently a member of the editorial boards of Dissent and Democracy, he lectures frequently and has contributed some four hundred articles, reviews, and op-ed pieces to publications such as the New York Review of Books, the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Los Angeles Times, The Atlantic, the London Review of Books, The American Scholar, The Nation, Le Monde, and Der Spiegel. He has also given congressional testimony, notably before the House Judiciary Committee in 1998. His writings on American music have earned him two Grammy nominations and two Deems Taylor-ASCAP awards.

00:00 Introduction to Country Over Self

00:33 Meet the Historian: Sean Wilentz

00:58 Abraham Lincoln: A Giant Among Presidents

02:22 The Emancipation Proclamation: Context and Challenges

13:10 Lincoln's Political Strategy and Manipulation

20:40 Lincoln's Conservative Stance and Emancipation Strategy

23:11 The Emancipation Proclamation's Impact on the War

24:07 Lincoln's Diplomatic Maneuvering and Military Challenges

26:46 Lincoln's Re-election and the End of the Civil War

29:04 Speculating on Lincoln's Second Term and Reconstruction

33:50 Closing Thoughts on Lincoln and Presidential Legacies

37:58 Final Questions and Reflections on American Politics

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Originally recorded on 10-24-24

In this episode, Matt and Mark talk about the 41st President, George H. W. Bush, and his campaign promise of "Read my lips, no new taxes" during the 1988 presidential campaign, and how that promise clashed with the realities of governing that led to the Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1990 and a balanced budget...and ultimately sowed the seeds of Bush's defeat in the 1992 election.

Mark Updegrove
Mark K. Updegrove is the president and CEO of the LBJ Foundation and serves as Presidential Historian for ABC News. From 2009 to 2017, he was the director of the LBJ Presidential Library, where in 2014 he hosted the Civil Rights Summit which included Presidents Obama, George W. Bush, Clinton, George H.W. Bush, and Carter.

Updegrove is the author of five books on the presidency including Incomparable Grace: JFK in the Presidency, published in 2022 and the executive producer of the CNN Original Series, “LBJ: Triumph and Tragedy.” He has written for the New York Times, Politico, Time, National Geographic, the Daily Beast, and USA Today, and has conducted exclusive interviews with seven U.S. presidents. His next book, Make Your Mark: Lessons in Character from Seven Presidents, will be published in March 2025.

Previously he was publisher of Newsweek and president of Time magazine’s Canadian edition. He is married to Amy Banner Updegrove, the former publisher of Texas Monthly, and lives in Austin, Texas.

00:00 Introduction to Country Over Self

00:34 Guest Introduction: Mark Updegrove

01:05 George H. W. Bush's Impressive Resume

02:22 The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1990

03:54 Bush's Controversial Tax Decision

06:47 Impact of Bush's Tax Compromise

09:57 Rise of Conservative Media and Its Effects

11:39 Ross Perot's Populist Candidacy

17:30 Bush's Legacy and the Clinton Letter

24:54 Rapid Fire Questions on Presidential Choices

30:50 Final Thoughts and Closing

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Originally recorded on 10-2-2024

00:00 Introduction to Country Over Self
00:33 Meet Joseph Ellis: Historian of John Adams
02:36 John Adams: The Most Human of the Founding Fathers
04:15 Adams' Role in the American Revolution
05:58 John Adams' Presidency and Political Challenges
11:23 Adams' Peace Treaty with France
26:25 Adams' Correspondence with Jefferson
34:00 Rapid Fire Questions and Reflections
38:58 Closing Remarks and Call to Action

In this episode, Matt and Joe talk about the 2nd President, John Adams, his unusual rationale for making virtuous decisions, the remarkable story of his retirement correspondence with Thomas Jefferson, and the importance of remembering the details of the era you're contemplating as a historian.

Joseph Ellis
Joseph J. Ellis is one of the nation's leading scholars of American history. The author of thirteen books, Ellis was awarded the Pulitzer Prize for Founding Brothers: the Revolutionary Generation and won the National Book Award for American Sphinx, a biography of Thomas Jefferson. His in-depth chronicle of the life of our first President, His Excellency: George Washington, was a New York Times bestseller.

Ellis’ most recent book, The Cause: The American Revolution and Its Discontents, was published by WW Norton in Fall 2021. In one of the most “exciting and engaging” (Gordon S. Wood) histories of the American founding in decades, Ellis offers thrilling accounts of the origins and clashing ideologies of America’s revolutionary era, recovering a war more brutal and more disorienting than any in our history, save perhaps the Civil War. Taking us from the end of the Seven Years’ War to 1783, The Cause interweaves action-packed tales of North American military campaigns with parlor-room intrigues back in England.

Ellis' essays and book reviews appear regularly in national publications, such as The New York Times, The Los Angeles Times, The Wall Street Journal, The Chicago Tribune, The New Republic, and The New Yorker. Ellis’s commentaries have been featured on CBS, CSPAN, CNN, and the PBS’s The News Hour, and he has appeared in several PBS documentaries on early America, including “John and Abigail [Adams]” a History Channel documentary on George Washington

Ellis has taught in the Leadership Studies program at Williams College, the Commonwealth Honors College at the University of Massachusetts, Mount Holyoke College, and the United States Military Academy at West Point. He lives in Vermont with his wife Ellen Wilkins Ellis and two big Labradoodles. He is the father of three sons.

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Originally recorded on 09-26-2024

In this episode, Matt and Rick talk about the 37th President, Richard Milhous Nixon as a case study of why there is no such thing as Country Over Self -- that successful politicians by definition fuse together their electoral success, their view of what's best for America, and therefore their actions while in office.

Rick Perlstein
Rick Perlstein is the author of the New York Times bestseller The Invisible Bridge: The Fall of Nixon and the Rise of Reagan; Nixonland: The Rise of a President and the Fracturing of America, a New York Times bestseller picked as one of the best nonfiction books of 2007 by over a dozen publications; and Before the Storm: Barry Goldwater and the Unmaking of the American Consensus, which won the 2001 Los Angeles Times Book Award for history and appeared on the best books of the year lists of The New York Times, The Washington Post, and the Chicago Tribune. His essays and book reviews have been published in The New Yorker, The New York Times, The Washington Post, The Nation, The Village Voice, and Slate, among others. A contributing editor and board member of In These Times magazine, he lives in Chicago.

00:00 Introduction to Country Over Self

00:57 Discussing Richard Nixon's Legacy

02:06 Exploring the Concept of Country Over Self

03:56 Nixon's Environmental Policies

06:24 Historical Examples of Presidential Decisions

08:34 The Complexity of Political Morality

14:43 Watergate and Its Implications

17:29 The Controversial Pardon of Nixon

23:04 Nixon's Rehabilitation and Legacy

27:37 Concluding Thoughts and Future Outlook

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Originally recorded on 09-27-2024

In this episode, Matt and Bill talk about the 32nd President, Franklin Delano Roosevelt and First Lady Eleanor Roosevelt. Roosevelt was in office longer than any other president and led the country through more turbulence, both home and abroad. And yet, what stands out is less Roosevelt's moral courage or altruism, and more his ability to fuse what he saw as good for the country with what was good for him politically, his shrewd political instincts, and his ability to mobilize both government and the population to get behind his vision and his policies. His wife Eleanor, one of the most politically active First Ladies, operated from a similar frame of reference.

HW Brands
H. W. BRANDS holds the Jack S. Blanton Sr. Chair in History at the University of Texas at Austin. A New York Times bestselling author, he was a finalist for the Pulitzer Prize in biography for The First American and Traitor to His Class. His most recent book is AMERICA FIRST: Roosevelt vs. Lindbergh in the Shadow of War.

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.

Recorded on 09-26-2024

In this episode, Matt and Troy talk about the 22nd and 24th President, Grover Cleveland, the only president to serve two non-sequential terms in history (up to this week's election of Donald Trump), and some of the interesting similarities to the party alignment circumstances to today's environment. Matt and Troy cover a number of vignettes from Cleveland's time in office, including the role that "doing the right thing" played in his political life, the shocking way he handled his cancer diagnosis and surgery, and the extraordinarily gracious way he handled his defeat and the inauguration of his successor in 1888, all during a time of immense transition for the Democratic Party.

Troy Senik
Troy Senik is a former White House speechwriter, having served under President George W. Bush during his second term. Today, he is the co-founder of Kite & Key, a non-profit digital media company dedicated to making public policy research accessible to the public. In 2022, he published his first book, A Man of Iron: The Turbulent Life and Improbable Presidency of Grover Cleveland, named by the Christian Science Monitor as one of the best books of 2022.

Senik’s career has spanned journalism, government, public policy, and non-profit leadership. He is a former columnist and member of the editorial board at the Orange County Register, the former opinion editor of the Los Angeles Daily Journal, and the former editor-in-chief of Ricochet. His writing has appeared in publications such as the Wall Street Journal, Los Angeles Times, National Affairs, City Journal, and The Guardian. He has served in senior leadership roles at the Los Angeles World Affairs Council and the Manhattan Institute for Public Policy, and also spent a decade as the host of a series of podcasts on public policy for the Hoover Institution at Stanford University.

A former Jeopardy! champion, Mr. Senik holds a bachelor’s degree in political science and philosophy from Belmont University and a master’s degree in public policy from Pepperdine University. Born and raised in Southern California, he currently lives in the New York City area.

To learn more about Country Over Self or to check out other episodes head to Countryoverself.com.

If you have an idea for an episode or want to reach Matt directly, please email podcast@countryoverself.com

Country Over Self is edited and produced by Culture Collaborative Media.